The Weekly Listen: Are we saying goodbye to the web, how hotels can capture the hearts of travelers, and more

On today’s podcast episode, we discuss how AI is shaping internet search, what social commerce will look like in two years’, how hotels are planning for shifting travelers expectations, a new approach to combating retail theft, the origins of London, and more. Tune in to the discussion with Senior Director of Podcasts and host Marcus Johnson, Vice President of Content Suzy Davidkhanian, Principal Analyst Bill Fisher, and Senior Analyst Carina Perkins.

Subscribe to the “Behind the Numbers” podcast on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Pandora, Stitcher, YouTube, Podbean or wherever you listen to podcasts. Follow us on Instagram.

Episode Transcript:

Marcus Johnson:

Partner with eMarketer on data-driven marketing materials. Our custom reports give eMarketer media solutions clients the opportunity to generate new category insights through original surveys and analysis. That's right. Visit eMarketer.com/advertise to learn more or for fun, either/or. Probably not for fun.

Hello, everyone. Thanks for hanging out with us for the Behind the Numbers weekly listen, an eMarketer podcast. This is the Friday show that wishes it had the confidence to just make up names at the coffee shop.

Do you guys give your real name?

Bill Fisher:

Yeah. Sorry.

Marcus Johnson:

See, wouldn't it be so much more fun if it was like, "Chai latte for Harry Potter"?

Carina Perkins:

Yeah, I should-

Marcus Johnson:

"That's a chai for Mr. Potter."

Carina Perkins:

No one can ever spell my name, so then you have to spell it out. It all just takes-

Marcus Johnson:

Corina?

Carina Perkins:

Carina.

Marcus Johnson:

They can't spell it?

Carina Perkins:

No.

Marcus Johnson:

Who are these people?

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Are you going to Starbucks? What other chains ask you for your name?

Marcus Johnson:

Every coffee shop.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Not here.

Marcus Johnson:

Where are you going?

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Even Dunkin Donuts doesn't ask. If I buy coffee out, I go to the local stores. But Dunkin Donuts is across the street from the office, and they don't ask you for your name.

Marcus Johnson:

That's a shame. You can't be Charles Dickens there then.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

No.

Marcus Johnson:

But everywhere else.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Cyndi Lauper.

Marcus Johnson:

Whoever you want.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Cyndi Lauper is who I'm going for.

Marcus Johnson:

Okay. Best of luck.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Thanks.

Marcus Johnson:

I'm your host, Marcus Johnson.

In today's show, how will we navigate the web differently? What will social commerce look like in a couple of years? How should hotels plan for shifting traveler expectations? Walmart has a new way to prevent retail theft, kind of. And I have some interesting facts for you about London. The real one, okay? Not the one in America. You took all our names. All right?

Anyway, in today's episode, we have three people. Let's meet them. We start with our vice president of content, heads up our retail and e-commerce desk based in New York City. It's Suzy Davidkhanian.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Hello. Thanks for having us.

Marcus Johnson:

Why of course.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

I'm saying us because we're all part of the British monarch Commonwealth.

Marcus Johnson:

Speaking for everyone, are we?

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Yep.

Marcus Johnson:

Okay, good. All right. We're also joined by a senior analyst who covers retail and e-commerce for us in the UK and Western Europe. She's based in England. We call her Carina Perkins or Charles Dickens.

Who would you be, Carina?

Carina Perkins:

I am going to have to think about that one.

Marcus Johnson:

Madonna?

Carina Perkins:

Madonna, perfect.

Marcus Johnson:

It's Madonna. Welcome to the show.

Carina Perkins:

Thanks for having me.

Marcus Johnson:

Of course. Pleasure.

We're also joined by a chap who covers the UK for us. He's our principal analyst based in England as well. We refer to him as Bill Fisher, aka ...

Bill Fisher:

Are you a Viz reader? Have you ever read the Viz comic before?

Marcus Johnson:

[inaudible 00:03:24] No.

Bill Fisher:

No. Maybe not for this audience. There was a character in there called Billy the Fish, which was my nickname as a kid.

Marcus Johnson:

Brilliant.

What do we have in store for you? A story, a game, some random trivia. Let's get on with it.

We start with the story of the week. How will we navigate the web differently? Well, Matteo Wong of The Atlantic writes that the AI is transforming how billions navigate the web. A lot will be lost in the process, since shaping how people navigate the internet is tantamount to shaping the internet itself. They're being shaped by the AI powered search engines.

What do we have? We've got Google's AI Overviews. That's out already for a select group of people in certain countries, coming to over 100 new countries as well. OpenAI has infused searchGPT with chatGPT. Perplexity wants to make its answer engine your default search tool.

In the piece, Mr. Wong says that after using all these search offerings, he tried to think about the future of how billions of people will access, relate to and synthesize information. For years, he says, we've used the search bar. Type something in and then we sift through the links, allowing, even forcing you to traverse the depth and breadth of connections that justify the term worldwide web. But AI search will just give you an answer, ending the need for further exploration.

Carina, I'll come to you first. What did you make of this piece from Mr. Wong?

Carina Perkins:

Yeah. I think it makes a lot of good points. I think this whole thing is a little bit scary. I think in some ways it's potentially going to be a bit of a step backwards.

If you look in the past, pre worldwide web, people were really at the mercy of the media moguls in terms of the information that they received. That information was often biased. It was really difficult for people to get views outside of those opinions.

Then the internet was born, and we can all read views from lots of different people. Sure, a lot of those views probably aren't worth the not paper they're printed on, but at least you can read lots of differing views.

Now we're going to put our trust back into the hands of massive corporations and our future AI overlords who are going to potentially be biased in the information that they give us. I think that's what I find most scary. If the delving into the topic ends with what the AI tells you, how do you know that that information doesn't have a bias? Because it inevitably will have some bias to it. I think that's quite scary.

I don't think it's just going to shape the internet. I think it's going to shape opinions. That has a potentially really scary outcome.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

It's interesting, because I didn't think about it that way. Because if you think about search engine optimization, even the non-paid, like the organic, it's people who understand the system and can rig, quote unquote, the system so that their links come up first.

As everybody who listens more regularly knows, I am an AI Overview pilot user. I really like it. When I ask it's the most basic questions, and it gives me an answer, and I'm like, "I don't know about this one," I keep searching to try and find what it's telling me. So I am curious if this will just change our routines.

Change is hard, and it means we have to do different things. I really hadn't thought about this monopoly on information. Will there be three people who will then tell us what to think, three firms who will then tell us what to think? I don't know.

Marcus Johnson:

Are you now searching for answers versus information? Because Perplexity is one of these AI search engines. Their chief business officer was saying people don't come to Perplexity to consume journalism. That seems like a fundamental shift in what people are using these things for.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

When I think about Googling, it's not to go and read what CNN or New York Times or BBC is saying. It's to go and find an answer. Where is the movie playing? How far is it to so and so? I've always used it in that way, so for me, it's making my life much easier.

Marcus Johnson:

Yeah. I wonder if there's room for both then, times when you want just a quick answer, you want to look up a restaurant, you want to find out when that thing happened, in what year in time, and you just want the answer quick. And then other times where you do want to go down the rabbit hole of a true search, and you wade through a bunch of different information so that you can learn different things.

Bill, what would you make of this piece?

Bill Fisher:

Well, it's interesting you talk about that, because I look at what happens in social and the difference between search and discovery in social. A lot of folks are heading to social channels, and that's where they're beginning their searches these days. But a lot of what happens on social is that serendipitous stuff, right? You're not necessarily searching for stuff. You're just consuming content and then you find this place that you might want to visit, which we might talk about in one of the later topics on the podcast today.

But the thing with this AI becoming the default search thing, I'm less effusive about it as perhaps Suzy is because I worry about that loss of serendipity and that you are just being fed the answer that AI tells you is the answer, when I might not necessarily want ... Obviously, people are looking for answers often when they do search, but it's that serendipitous stuff that I feel we're going to lose if I'm just searching for something.

And there is the SEO thing. The first page is going to be optimized. But I often go deep and look a few pages down, and I find other stuff. I'm just concerned that's going to disappear.

Marcus Johnson:

Yeah. You mentioned that at times you want the answer. The thing is, who are you getting the answer from? Because the piece was saying AI search makes mistakes the same way that the links offered by traditional search engines are filled with errors.

However, Mr. Wong was writing, search bots implicitly ask for your trust without verification. That seems to be a bit of a sticking point here is that, "Hang on a second. Who's this search bot who's telling me the answer?" It feels like there's a thing giving you the answer, and why should I trust this thing, versus you looking yourself through certain links, certain sources that you trust, and then saying, "Okay. I know of that news brand. I know the BBC. I can trust it. I know the Associated Press. I can trust it," etc.

Then there's another thing he was mentioning, the citations. Even though they're listed, Suzy, to what you were saying, the AI Overviews with Google, it gives you the answer, it lists some of the citations, but they don't particularly invite you to click on them the way that traditional search does. Fair?

Suzy Davidkhanian:

I don't know. Well, I think Bill said something very smart around the intention of using Google. Sorry, I'm paraphrasing Bill right now. If you're going to Google to learn, then you're going to ask the question. If you're going to discover new information that you didn't even know you needed to know, is really Google the place you're going? Are you going to a search engine for that? It's much more reactive a search engine than it is like drawing you in. Then you go to your favorite news site to see what they're telling you on the front page of the things you need to know.

So maybe it all just starts with what are you trying to achieve when you're going to search, and what is the path of least resistance. Google even asks you other questions. If you Google something like, "Tell me fun facts about Thanksgiving," it'll give you some in the overview, it'll give you other questions you can ask, and then it'll still have all of the different random, of course half of them are ad sponsored, but it'll still have random links you can search through.

Marcus Johnson:

Is your Dinner Party Data on Thanksgiving?

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Obviously.

Bill Fisher:

I was just going to say, how many of us always Google or ask AI, "What's my Dinner Party Data going to be today?"

Marcus Johnson:

Just you and Suzy, maybe Carina too.

Carina Perkins:

I think of a topic and then I Google it. I don't just know the facts off the top of my head, unfortunately.

Bill Fisher:

Nice. Go the extra mile for us.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Right? Me too. It started with Thanksgiving. Usually, I Google, "What is X Day celebrated for?"

Bill Fisher:

Yeah, you do. That's what you'll ... Yeah.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Then it's like, Ice Cream Day, Coffee Day.

Bill Fisher:

Cappuccino Day.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

The last time was Coffee Day. Yeah, that's it. That's how I start my fun facts.

Marcus Johnson:

Thanks for putting the effort in, gang.

I'll end with this. I thought this was a really interesting line from the piece. Mr. Wong was saying the change will be equivalent ... The change in how we're going to be using the internet, looking for things, searching for things, getting answers. The change will be the equivalent of going from navigating a library with the Dewey Decimal System and thus encountering related books on adjacent shelves, to requesting books for pickup through a digital catalog. It could completely reorient our relationship to knowledge, prioritizing rapid, detailed and abridged answers over a deep understanding and the consideration of varied sources and viewpoints. If these companies really have their way, AI people, no more hyperlinks and thus no actual web.

We'll see. That's all we've got time for the story of the week. We move swiftly to the game of the week.

Today's game is the super duper game. How does it work? Three rounds. Today we have Fortune Teller, Pretend CEO, and Fill in the Blank. The better the answers, the more points you get.

Round one. We'll start with Carina for this one. Fortune Teller is what we're playing for round one, where we predict the future. What will social commerce look like in a couple of years? Well, currently, "Shoppers browse on social commerce sites but shy away from purchasing," writes Zachary Russell of Chain Store Age. He points to a new survey from e-commerce software as a service company AfterShip and Ipsos showing that three in four folks browse social commerce platforms for products, but go on to buy through a retailer's website.

Fortune Teller is the name of the game for this round. Carina, what will social commerce look like in two years' time?

Carina Perkins:

I think we're going to see that kind of in-app purchasing, so completing purchases on social commerce platforms, becoming a bit more popular. We've seen from previous surveys that the generation who are most likely to do it, perhaps unsurprisingly, are Gen Z. As they gain more purchasing power, perhaps we're going to see some incremental growth on that.

I don't think we're going to see a sudden huge shift to lots of people completing their purchases on social commerce platforms, but I think it is going to become more common, especially as TikTok shop gains additional sales, because they've got that native checkout in the UK. We're actually quite limited in terms of how we can check out via social platforms. It's just TikTok shop that offers the ability to do that.

Something I think we will also start seeing is that social is going to play a bigger role in discovery among older age groups. In the UK certainly, we are seeing social commerce, which we define as purchases that are happening immediately after people are discovering products on social commerce, be that on the retailers website or on the social platform, that's on the rise across all age groups.

So I think that we're going to really see social commerce playing a bigger role, but I don't think there's going to be a sudden transformation in the next two years. I think it's going to be more incremental changes.

Marcus Johnson:

Bill?

Bill Fisher:

Yeah, I boringly agree with Carina. I think in two years, that's quite a small span, I don't think things will look incredibly different.

Just to pick up on the Gen Z thing, again, just because I've been writing about Gen Z most recently, just to add to that point, in two years' time, Gen Z will begin at age 14, so we still have a large chunk of that demographic that don't really have purchase power.

But Gen Z, social is so central to their lives and it cuts across activities, so for media consumption, video news, right through to retailing. So I've no doubt that social commerce will ramp up as Gen Z ages into this financially independent population. So not much change in two years, but definitely moving towards the mainstream.

Marcus Johnson:

Suzy.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

I think this is why it's really important to understand your markets and who your consumers are so that you make the right strategy decision. I think in the US, it's going to come much further along than in the UK, Western Europe, in that I think there are definitely more platforms that offer it.

The hiccup has always been originally around in-app checkout versus sending you to the retailer. There are values in being sent to the retailer for the retailer and the consumer, but obviously, the social platforms want to keep you on their own app, in their own digital properties, to have the whole checkout happen. From a trust perspective, I think the social platforms will have to just spend more time doing fraud verified or other quick conversion hits to get over that hurdle.

But we know that shoppable media is a really big deal. Live streaming is increasing. In two years, I think social will be so intertwined you might not even realize until you get your credit card out that you're making a purchase on the social platform versus being on the Macy's website. It'll be more seamless and much more sophisticated.

Marcus Johnson:

Yeah, interesting. Touched on something there which I wanted to speak about, which was the trust part of this. Social commerce does seem to have some trust issues. Two points to that. Folks would use social commerce if the platforms felt more trustworthy, 44%, and secure at 28%, according to the article, AfterShip and Ipsos. The second point, 53% of US consumers don't trust purchases on social media, according to a 2023 iBuy survey.

Social commerce, it's happening but it's not quite as advanced as it is in other countries. That's why it might feel like we're further behind it in the US, the UK, than we should be is because if you look at this chart here, you can see that over 90% of folks in China, Thailand, Colombia, India, a lot of countries have bought something via social commerce. That's compared to just 53% of people in America and about similar share in the UK as well. It's from 2024 research from VML.

In two years' time, we do have some numbers on this in the US, retail social commerce sales, they're going to grow quite a lot actually. They're going from about 72 billion to across the $100 billion mark, we think, in two years' time. So it's an additional $30 billion there. Then social buyers will notch up slightly by about three or four million each in the next couple of years.

Let's move to round two. We'll start with Bill for this one. We're playing Pretend CEO, where our panel pretend to be a CEO for a day. We're talking about how hotels can capture the hearts of Millennial and Gen Z Travelers. It's an article from LG Business Solutions in a piece written for travel news site Skift.

According to Skift research, most Millennial and Gen Z travelers plan to increase their travel spending in the next year. Over 75% will take two or more trips in that timeframe. About two thirds of them said hotels were their number one accommodation preference, far outpacing short-term rentals and staying with family and friends. The article notes that travelers now expect everything from self-service experiences to environmentally conscious amenities.

The question though, for Bill first, is if you were the pretend CEO of a hotel, how would you plan for the shifting traveler expectations?

Bill Fisher:

Yeah. The article also made an interesting point about making your locations Instagrammable or TikTokable. I don't think that should be underestimated. Talking about Gen Z again. Can you tell I've been writing about Gen Z? I also own two Gen Zers. My kids, they want to go places based off what they've seen on TikTok and Instagram, and food is ... They're ruled by their stomachs. Clearly food is a big thing for them. We've traveled many places to try out some food that they've seen on these platforms.

So if I owned a hotel, I would be putting some fancy bakery just off the foyer and TikToking the hell out of it, and attracting Gen Zers that way.

Marcus Johnson:

Nice. Suzy.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

I love this question. I think hotels, it's like this intersection of an experience and a service plus a retail experience, with selling products and trying to intertwine them. So if I was the CEO, I would try and figure out a way to make that balance very authentic, and to not lean too heavily on one side versus the other.

For example, I know sustainability is really important. I know what I'm about to say is going to shock people, but those shower things where you have to squeeze the bottle and there's never enough liquid because we're trying to be sustainable, those are brutal. So I feel like, as a hotel owner, I would figure out a way to have the right balance between what is expected, what is effective, what is seamless, and making sure that ...

As the article was pointing out, a lot of people are doing workations, where they're working and then they're vacationing, or they're extended work trips. So make sure that you offer things like a lobby ... I don't have Gen Zers in my household, so I'm not thinking about a bakery. I'm thinking about a lobby bar that's cool, or a happy hour cocktail to welcome your guests, or other fun things that could be Instagrammable but that are really bringing people together into an experience.

Marcus Johnson:

Carina.

Carina Perkins:

Yeah. If I was CEO for the day, I think I would really focus on building a killer app, as well as the two things that Bill and Suzy covered off. I'm thinking you have an app, it enables people to self-serve so they can check in. There's less rigidity around check-in times and check-out times perhaps. They can maybe connect with other travelers who are staying in the hotel, if they want to, maybe have some communal spaces, climbing walls, cafes, board game areas so that people can connect. Gen Z are really big into wellness, so perhaps some kind of spa treatments that people can book in the app.

I think again, yeah, food, maybe some kind of vending machines that you pay using the app and get some cheaper snacks, or you can order room service to your room. And then perhaps having a loyalty element to it as well. Then you could gamify it and make it, "If you post on TikTok about our cafe, then you get 10% off your next trip."

Marcus Johnson:

A busy day for you as CEO, but some good ideas. Before we move on, actually yeah, I did say how hotels can capture the hearts and minds of Millennial and Gen Z travelers. Folks might be thinking, "Hang on a second. What about the other people?" There was a point made in this piece that the younger generations are making up a larger share of the traveler market. Millennials and Gen Zers are projected to account for 83% of hotel guests by 2030. It may seem like a long way away, but it's just five years. That's according to an LG Business Solutions report.

All right, we move to round three. Carina and Suzy are out in front, tied on four. Bill just behind on three. So all to play for. Round three, we have Fill in the Blank. Suzy's going first, where folks do that. We're talking about Walmart trying a new approach to combat retail theft.

This is an article written by our senior retail analyst, Zak Stambor. In it, he notes that Walmart is testing technology in its stores that lets workers use their cell phones to open locked cases housing items like deodorants and baby formula. This is a note from Bloomberg. Zak explains that the technology is live in a few hundred Walmart stores, rolling out the test to employees first, but may extend mobile unlocking to Walmart+ loyalty members.

Folks who've been to any pharmacy in the US know that when you want to buy something, a lot of the time or some of the time, it can be locked behind a little case, and you have to go get an employee. That's what we're talking about here. They want to basically give employees the ability to use their phones to do so or maybe loyalty members.

So Fill in the Blank. Suzy's going first. This new idea from Walmart, to let workers and maybe loyalty members use their smartphones to open locked cases housing certain items is blank.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Is brilliant, especially the loyalty plus members. We all know there's a lot of friction points. There's theft. There's a lot of things that have to be balanced. The reason why things are locked up is not consumer friendly, but if they're not locked up, it's not retail margin friendly. Even though it's one toothpaste at a time, it all adds up to their bottom line. Not having an employee need to go find the key that they're all sharing seems like a big win for everybody, the consumer waiting in line to get their thing opened ... For everybody, it seems like a win.

But to have that available for the loyalty members I think is the win. It's like the whole thing about price scanning. There was a minute where if you downloaded the app, you can use your app to price scan merchandise in department stores, and so people downloaded the app. I think this will be a reason why people will become a member of the Walmart+ program.

Marcus Johnson:

Carina.

Carina Perkins:

Yeah. I've got a bit of a different view on it. I think it's a bit risky. Obviously, the layer of friction has already been added because these boxes exist. I agree with Suzy that potentially if it's much easier for staff to unlock it, that's a good thing.

But I'm a bit confused about the rollout to the Walmart+ members, because are we assuming that everyone's trying to steal it unless you're a loyalty card member, in which case you wouldn't possibly steal anything? I'm not really sure I understand the logic there. Also, you're then asking customers to do something which is a staff job, which as we know from the automated checkouts here, it doesn't always go down that well. And you're perhaps pleasing your Walmart+ customers, but then you're alienating all of your other customers by saying, "Unless you're part of our membership program, we're going to treat you as a thief." So I think it's a bit risky, personally. I think it could have a bit of a backlash.

Marcus Johnson:

Bill.

Bill Fisher:

Yeah. I'm coming from Carina's side, I guess because based in the UK and this isn't really a thing over here. I think this is a bit sad. I think it reflects badly on society that we are having to think this way, that we have to lock up deodorant, for Christ's sake. Good grief.

In the UK, we don't lock things up, but we do put security tags on things. I've seen security tags be put on things like cheese. There was a big cheese theft in the UK recently. Look that up in the news. That was interesting. I think that's sad as well, but it's the state of society where we're at, unfortunately, cost of living and all that kind of thing.

But practically thinking, I look at this and I think, "Okay. You're going to do it, but there's got to be a sliding scale." I think in the piece it talked about how folks are happy to wait for things like electronic goods to be unlocked, but not to wait for deodorant to be unlocked. So I think there should be a sliding scale when the friction becomes too great for the value of the goods. I'm in the pool of people who will shop elsewhere if they're locking up their deodorant.

Marcus Johnson:

Yeah, yeah. To that point, you're saying folks will leave and shop elsewhere if an item that they want is locked up. 27% of consumers will shop elsewhere rather than wait for assistance for a locked up item. That's a lot of folks. One in four, obviously [inaudible 00:28:19]

Bill, really quickly, you were saying security tags, just for folks not in the UK, they basically just get taken off at checkout?

Bill Fisher:

Yeah. It's a bit of friction, but it's much less friction because you just have a few items.

Marcus Johnson:

Right. You're already at checkout.

Bill Fisher:

Yeah.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

There's lots of ways of going about it. I do think that if you are a loyalty plus member though, it doesn't mean that you're less likely to steal. Just means that you're going to have put your phone against the thing to unlock it. If it's not in your bill but it's missing, then Walmart might be able to say, "The deodorant is missing. Suzy opened the case with her phone but she didn't purchase one, so now we're going to ding her."

Marcus Johnson:

It's odd though because it doesn't seem like retail theft is up, so it's weird that we all of a sudden need to lock everything away. I'm sure it varies by store, but there were some numbers in one of the articles we're reading. It says, "While reported incidents of shoplifting climbed year-on-year in 2023, they were roughly at the same level as pre-pandemic 2019 according to recent FBI data." So maybe there's other data suggesting that theft is rampant, but it does seem odd and a bit sad, to what you guys were saying, that this needs to be the case.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

I think it's the margin. Margins are lower. They're razor-thin, so any kind of theft eats into the margin, and they'd rather spend the money on promotions.

Marcus Johnson:

Yeah. All right, folks. That's it for the game. Count the scores. Carina is this week's winner of the game of the week. Congratulations to you. Six points. Bill and Suzy tied on five. You get the championship belt.

Carina Perkins:

Thanks very much. The championship belt.

Marcus Johnson:

I know. We spoil you. And the last word.

Carina Perkins:

I feel like I've said all my words.

Marcus Johnson:

Okay. All of them? Nothing else? You finished for life?

Carina Perkins:

Well, I've got some great Dinner Party Data, but what's the last word? It's been a pleasure for all of us from the Commonwealth to be with you today.

Marcus Johnson:

Okay. Someone else speaking on behalf of millions of people.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

I love it.

Carina Perkins:

Why not?

Marcus Johnson:

Yeah, fair enough. Charles does it.

All right, gang, that's all we've got time for for the game of the week. We move now to Dinner Party Data. This is the part of the show where we tell you about the most interesting thing we've done this week. Carina goes first. Did I say most interesting we've done this week?

Carina Perkins:

We've done. Yeah.

Marcus Johnson:

We've learned.

Carina Perkins:

I wasn't going to tell people about that.

Marcus Johnson:

What we've learned this week.

Carina Perkins:

Shocker, and I don't want to panic everyone, but I don't know if you've heard the big news in the UK at the moment is that there is a shortage of taramasalata. It's the most middle class panic in the world. There is a shortage of taramasalata.

Marcus Johnson:

Explain.

Carina Perkins:

You know what taramasalata is? It's a Greek dip, cod roe, pink, nice with pita bread.

Marcus Johnson:

Delightful.

Carina Perkins:

Lots of people are panicking because their lunch plans are spoiled because you can't get any taramasalata. Apparently, it's been caused by strikes at a factory in the Midlands. I did try and find some really interesting data about taramasalata, but unfortunately, I failed.

So I found some interesting information on strikes, because strikes have become quite rampant in the UK in the last couple of years. In the last two years, we've seen the highest level of industrial action in the UK since the 1980s, according to the Resolution Foundation. In the 12 months to May 2023, around four million working days were lost to strikes. That compares to an average of 450,000 per year during the 2010s. It's more than at any point since 1989. Things have slowed down a little bit since then, but in the year to May 2024, there was still 1.6 million working days lost. So there's been a lot more strike action than previously. However, to put it into context, it still pales in comparison to the 1970s. In September 1979, in that month alone, there were over 11 million working days lost to strike action.

Marcus Johnson:

Wow. It's tough, strikes. It's tough with them. They're a massive inconvenience, especially if you're trying to get the tube or subway in London. But it also means that people are coming together to stand up for themselves because they're not happy with something. So it swings around about.

Carina Perkins:

When it starts affecting your taramasalata supply ...

Marcus Johnson:

Exactly. You've got real problems.

Carina Perkins:

... you lose sympathy.

Marcus Johnson:

That's true. Enough already.

Suzy.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

We all know I'm going to talk about Thanksgiving.

Marcus Johnson:

What did you learn about Thanksgiving?

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Black Friday in two weeks. Christmas is in less than six weeks. The new year is in less than seven weeks. Retailers, you have five less days between Thanksgiving and Christmas, so really important to get focused.

When I wanted to see what Thanksgiving food sales were like, there were too many different numbers. So I am going with, like I did last year, Campbell Soup has an independent study. It is very meticulous. It's the fourth year. Do you know what is the number one side this year, which is not same as last year?

Marcus Johnson:

You're asking three Brits. This is a terrible decision, to bring Thanksgiving-

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Stuffing is number one.

Marcus Johnson:

Perfect.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Mashed potatoes, number two. Sweet potatoes, number three. It was number four last year. Green bean casserole, this one I don't understand, is number four, up from five. Mac cheese-

Carina Perkins:

Why don't you understand that one? You don't like the green bean casserole?

Suzy Davidkhanian:

I don't know about green casserole. I don't think I've ever had a real one, so I'm not sure if I can comment on it.

Carina Perkins:

I've never had one at all, but I like green beans.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Yeah, me too. I love green beans. I feel like this is very saucy and salty, but I could be wrong.

Number five, mac and cheese, which surprised me that it slid from number three to number five. The Northeast region loves stuffing the most, and the southeast region serves the most side dishes at seven side dishes.

The turkey is not usually the most popular thing. However, a bonus fact, 50% of all whole turkeys sold in the USA are consumed on this day.

Marcus Johnson:

Half, you said?

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Yeah, 50% of all whole turkey birds, so not the turkey breast, the whole turkey birds sold in the US are consumed on Thanksgiving.

Carina Perkins:

When else are people eating whole turkeys?

Suzy Davidkhanian:

I think some people eat it for Christmas.

Carina Perkins:

I'm surprised it's not higher. Yeah, we do in the UK.

Marcus Johnson:

It's a Wednesday.

What are we doing? No one's ever been at a restaurant with anyone, or around anyone, and heard them go ...

Carina Perkins:

"I'll have turkey."

Marcus Johnson:

"I'll have the turkey, please."

Carina Perkins:

[inaudible 00:35:29] baffles me.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Well, my mom started using turkey instead of chicken in some of her Iranian dishes, and it's really good. It's a much juicier meat. Just saying. But it's not the whole turkey, obviously.

Marcus Johnson:

Terrible decision.

Bill.

Bill Fisher:

Okay. Carina said she'd run out of words, so I've got a new one for you. Are you ready for this?

Marcus Johnson:

[inaudible 00:35:55]

Bill Fisher:

Hippopotomonstrosesquippedaliophobia. [inaudible 00:36:01] Any idea what that is? It has phobia in the name.

Marcus Johnson:

You just made it up.

Carina Perkins:

Scared of hippopotamus?

Bill Fisher:

Close. It's a fear of long words. That's something that I learned this week. It's a mix of Greek and Latin. Obviously, the hippopotamus, monstrous. Sesquipedalian is a term that ... It's a Latin term, literally means a foot and a half long. That was coined by a Roman poet in the first century BC. He used it to criticize writers who used words that he said were a foot and a half long. Some of my editors accuse me of this, I think.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Is that the context of where you learnt the word?

Bill Fisher:

Yeah, that's right. Heather told me, "You sesquipedalians."

Suzy Davidkhanian:

I love it. That's awesome.

Marcus Johnson:

Very good, very good. All right. I've got one for you real quick. Five facts about London. First one is ... London, capital of England and the UK, is home to nine million folks. 25% of them were born elsewhere, overseas. In London, you can hear about 300 different languages spoken. That's the first bit of trivia.

Second, the area was originally settled by early hunter-gatherers around 6,000 BC, according to History.com. Many, many years later, ancient Romans founded a port and trading settlement called Londinium in 43 AD which eventually would become modern day London, as we now call it, after being called many other things, including Ludenwick, Ludenburg, Londres and other names.

Number three. Opened in 1863, the Metropolitan Railway between Paddington and Farringdon was the first urban underground railway in the world. Two more. London Heathrow is the largest airport in Europe and the fourth largest globally, in terms of passengers.

Five, last year, London was the second most visited city in the world, according to Euromonitor. Guesses for number one?

Suzy Davidkhanian:

New York.

Bill Fisher:

Paris.

Marcus Johnson:

Carina?

Carina Perkins:

I was going to say Paris as well. Should I choose another one?

Marcus Johnson:

You should. Yeah, probably. The center point of the hub of the whole world. The center of the world, if you were traveling. What does everything have to go through? Not everything.

Carina Perkins:

[inaudible 00:38:42]

Marcus Johnson:

This is a terrible clue. What did you say?

Carina Perkins:

[inaudible 00:38:45] It's where I live. It was a joke.

Marcus Johnson:

Okay.

Bill Fisher:

[inaudible 00:38:51]

Marcus Johnson:

Bill and Carina live close. That's why they're the only two people who laughed.

Carina Perkins:

It's a bit of a joke.

Marcus Johnson:

That's a real inside one. Istanbul. So close.

That's all we have time for.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Is that the number of people who've gone through the airport, or it's the number of people who've actually gone to visit?

Marcus Johnson:

No, visited the city.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Shocking.

Marcus Johnson:

Shocking?

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Yeah.

Marcus Johnson:

London or Istanbul?

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Istanbul.

Marcus Johnson:

Okay. Good job, with three Brits on here.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Yeah. No, I'm surprised that it's not New York or ... I don't know. I just thought somehow ... Not because I live in New York. I would've otherwise said Toronto if it was an emotional connection.

Marcus Johnson:

Surprised you didn't, to be honest.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Should have said Yerevan.

Marcus Johnson:

That's all we've got time for today's episode. Thank you so much to my guests, as always. Thank you to Suzy.

Suzy Davidkhanian:

Thanks for having me.

Marcus Johnson:

Of course. Thank you to Bill.

Bill Fisher:

Thanks, Marcus.

Marcus Johnson:

Yes indeed. Thank you to Carina.

Carina Perkins:

Thanks, Marcus.

Marcus Johnson:

Yes, yes. This week's winner of the game of the week and champion. Thank you to Victoria who edits the show. Stuart runs the team. Sophie does our social media. Lance runs our video podcast. Thanks to everyone for listening in. We hope to see you on Monday in Behind the Numbers daily. That is an eMarketer podcast. Happiest of weekends.